Hopbot log for 2008-01-27 - Helma IRC channel: #helma on irc.freenode.net

2008-01-27:

[0:02] <zumbrunn> interesting... so, how is it working so far on helma?
[0:03] <saikko> yes :)
[0:04] <saikko> I mean, quite fine
[0:05] <saikko> the features I managed to implement work as I expected
[0:06] <zumbrunn> :-)
[0:06] <saikko> it works in Firefox (client-side execution) as well, but I want it to be server-side library
[0:07] <saikko> http://pawel.gada.pl/code/jstal/examples/clientside.html (data and template: http://pawel.gada.pl/code/jstal/examples/test.js )
[0:08] <saikko> Helma example is in that .zip in "downloads" on google code, I don't have any public server with helma to provide a link
[0:11] <zumbrunn> ok, download count is at "1" now :-)
[0:12] <saikko> whoa! ;)
[0:18] <saikko> zumbrunn: I'm a front-end web developer and TAL works great for me because I can build and test templates without any data and then just run them on the server, so I like this solution not because of features, but because of how I build templates - template is valid XHTML, so live validation in Eclipse doesn't underline everything, and I can open each template in the browser while working on it and have temporary data rendered properly. It's not possible with S
[0:21] <zumbrunn> I didn't get all that...
[0:21] <zumbrunn> your text got cut off after "It's not possible with S"
[0:21] <saikko> ... It's not possible with SMARTY or other template engines which use special markup other than attributes
[0:26] <zumbrunn> in the test.js, is there a reason why you need the new XML() syntax around the xml literal?
[0:28] <zumbrunn> (or do you just prefer it that way)
[0:29] <saikko> I think it's just a preference - or avoiding possible problems in different implementations
[0:30] <zumbrunn> ok
[0:31] <zumbrunn> this looks definitely interesting
[0:31] <zumbrunn> I'll play around with it some more tomorrow
[0:31] * zumbrunn goes to catch some sleep now
[0:32] <saikko> you may use only a part (or parts) of the engine, for example res.write( jstal(template).defineGlobal(global).content().attributes().tpl)
[0:32] <saikko> ok, 'night
[1:17] <midnightmonster> zumbrunn, it's not the first you've heard of TAL/PHPTAL, 'cause that
[1:17] <midnightmonster> 's what I use/used in PHP before I came to Helma, too
[1:18] <midnightmonster> and "bard" (Massimiliano Mirra) on here built a TAL-inspired thing with e4x, too.
[1:19] <midnightmonster> he was the one talking about the e4x performance problems in rhino
[1:19] <midnightmonster> (saikko, should you happen to read this, those issues have been partly resolved and in my experience don't present a problem for actual use anyway)
[1:21] <midnightmonster> (saikko, you absolutely do not need that new XML() notation. there's only the two e4x implementations to speak of (rhino and spidermonkey) and neither one needs it. actually I think AS4 has e4x, too.)
[7:48] <zumbrunn> right, this morning, fresh out of bed, I'm sufficiently detoxicated to remember that
[10:56] <saikko> midnightmonster, you're right - new XML() isn't neccessary
[10:57] <saikko> an yes, ActionScript has E4X implementation (but that's AS3 ;))
[10:58] <zumbrunn> btw, I noticed, midnightmonster aka jsp has brought up TAL himself before on this channel as well:
[10:58] <zumbrunn> http://helma.zumbrunn.com/hopbot/2007-07-20
[10:59] <zumbrunn> and like midnightmonster said, bard is also working on something like this
[10:59] <zumbrunn> so, he'll probably be pleased about your jstal efforts
[11:01] <saikko> well, if I can make METAL work in my implementation it may be quite useful (metal is for macros: define-macro, use-macro - so you can share snippets of XML trees across templates)
[11:02] <saikko> but now I'm playing with CouchDB's JSON results -> JSTAL -> HTML :)
[11:02] <zumbrunn> that's sweet as well :-)
[13:23] <saikko> both Helma nad JSTAL really work great with CouchDB :]
[13:24] <saikko> do you plan closer Helma/CouchDB integration?
[13:27] <zumbrunn> yes, I believe that's what Hannes is hinting at when he mentions JSAdapter and/or JOMP as "the missing link" for helma
[13:28] <zumbrunn> http://dev.helma.org/weblog/2008/01/jsadapter_missing_link/
[13:28] <zumbrunn> not specifically regarding couchdb
[13:28] <zumbrunn> but it would allow a more flexible way of mapping hopobjects against a data backend
[13:29] <zumbrunn> (as an alternative for the current built-in xml db)
[13:31] <zumbrunn> ...and couchdb integration would be one example that could benefit from this
[13:35] <saikko> great!
[14:46] <midnightmonster> second cool/great

 

 

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